[editor's note: posted by Jeff Thompson]

 

Well I am not sure to say I am fortunate or unfortunate to know people who "pass" both tests!

 

I think everyone that has worked with others, again this time I will say unfortunately, has engaged others that passed both tests with flying colors.  Especially now, as conflict specialists, our job is to work with this people.

 

What I absolutely loved is how Sutton distinguishes the difference between the temporary and certified *sshole.  I admit, personally, I am sure I have been the temporary one.  I think reflecting on the wheel of conflict that Moore created, our emotions get involved and often that can allow people to become the temporary *sshole due to the response of a given situation. Lol, the title of temporary changes to certified when it becomes a pattern!

 

What really sticks with me in the first chapter, and has since the first time I read this book over a year ago, was a comment on page 34.  Sutton states:

 

"The best evidence is that jerks succeed despite rather than because of their nasty ways." (italic added by me).

 

Just because something gets done- a project, task, or program- by acting like a bully, jerk or *sshole, doesn't make it alright, okay or a model of success.  I think people can easily fall into the trap of saying we'll deal with it, or that's just the way he/she is, or oh well- he/she gets things done.  

 

As professionals, and those who work especially with conflict at organizations, I look forward to reading your posts- especially the success stories!

 

 

Views: 62

Replies to This Discussion

I agree that we have all worked with those who have passed the test, both prongs, with flying colors. I differ in your "enthusiasm" in working with such people.

 

I absolutely agree with how you mention we fall into traps into almost excusing ***hole behavior by claiming "that's how he/she is." Have you also experienced when people say how mean/bullying someone is but then they'll say "oh but he/she is so smart, he has a degree in (blank)." I'm always thinking - how do those things connect? Because he/she majored in some field or got an advanced degree they can be an ***hole? I've heard it more than once and each time it baffles me.

 

But in the same respect, it is easier to excuse the behavior as labeling the person an ***hole and moving on with your life. It's hard to think you can change the circumstances or even that person. It's probably even worse now days with the fear in the job market. I bet people are putting up with a lot more than they would have a few years ago.

Btw- sorry I posted the original post under the admin user name when it was supposed to be under me.

 

Oops- I hope it doesn't make me an *sshole!

 

:)

Haha. I was wondering who was writing under the Werner Institute name! I guessed it was Bryan or maybe even Theresa. No worries.

Jeff Thompson said:

Btw- sorry I posted the original post under the admin user name when it was supposed to be under me.

 

Oops- I hope it doesn't make me an *sshole!

 

:)

Being in sales for the past three years, I feel it is way too easy to fall for the "ends justify the means" slogan. It is too easy to equate the end sales numbers to the process by which it was achieved. In many cases, the assholes in sales seem to do really well for a short amount of time. Others see this and can't help but think they may need to imitate their actions to get the same results. However, after being there three years, it was the true non-assholes that succeed long-term. Those same employees seem to breed a culture of non-assholes that brings with it better sales, worker stability, and a generally good working experience.

 

I enjoyed what Sutton found soon after the assholes were let go from an organization. Many times they wished they would have let them go much earlier. I think that speaks volumes on the effect assholes have on an organization.

Hi Nicole.

You make a great point about our economy and people putting up with these type of people in the workplace. I would like to hear from you (or anyone:) Do you think employers are putting up with them or more willing to fire jerks, as jobs are more limited and the job pool larger. Do you think these so called people recognize the kind of economy that we live in, therefore behave better, or does it matter?

 

Lynsee

 


Nicole Bohe said:

I agree that we have all worked with those who have passed the test, both prongs, with flying colors. I differ in your "enthusiasm" in working with such people.

 

I absolutely agree with how you mention we fall into traps into almost excusing ***hole behavior by claiming "that's how he/she is." Have you also experienced when people say how mean/bullying someone is but then they'll say "oh but he/she is so smart, he has a degree in (blank)." I'm always thinking - how do those things connect? Because he/she majored in some field or got an advanced degree they can be an ***hole? I've heard it more than once and each time it baffles me.

 

But in the same respect, it is easier to excuse the behavior as labeling the person an ***hole and moving on with your life. It's hard to think you can change the circumstances or even that person. It's probably even worse now days with the fear in the job market. I bet people are putting up with a lot more than they would have a few years ago.

Hi Matt.

 

I was wondering what your thoughts are on the sales field and these certified assholes. It seems to me that the sales industry has more of these type of people. Would you agree? If so, why do you think it is? If not, are these people in every organization and I somehow may have biases from working in that field myself. I also am curious to know how the certified jerks went away after a few years, did they just leave or were they forced to leave because of their behavior?

 

Lynsee

 

Matthew J Starman said:

Being in sales for the past three years, I feel it is way too easy to fall for the "ends justify the means" slogan. It is too easy to equate the end sales numbers to the process by which it was achieved. In many cases, the assholes in sales seem to do really well for a short amount of time. Others see this and can't help but think they may need to imitate their actions to get the same results. However, after being there three years, it was the true non-assholes that succeed long-term. Those same employees seem to breed a culture of non-assholes that brings with it better sales, worker stability, and a generally good working experience.

 

I enjoyed what Sutton found soon after the assholes were let go from an organization. Many times they wished they would have let them go much earlier. I think that speaks volumes on the effect assholes have on an organization.

Matthew J Starman said:

...I enjoyed what Sutton found soon after the assholes were let go from an organization. Many times they wished they would have let them go much earlier. I think that speaks volumes on the effect assholes have on an organization.

 

 

Matt,

 

That's the thing- I think most, if not all, organizations think/say that, but it's getting them to actually do something about which seems to be the hard part!  

 

I think all to often the 'victims' don't know what to do or know their options and end up lumping it for many reasons (can't leave the job, feel embarrassed, he/she treats everyone like that, etc.)

 

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